Stadium designers explain their vision

It may not be a surprise they hold these views - they did, after all, design the Forsyth Barr Stadium - but Richard Breslin and Marko den Breems think the building near Dunedin's waterfront is a winner. David Loughrey talks to the two men who took the stadium from an idea to a reality.

"This is about as good as it gets," Richard Breslin said, as he watched what had once been design drawings rise from the rubble of the former industrial area at Awatea St.

"One of the amazing things about this building, from across the whole world, it's the first there's been a fixed roof over a natural pitch.

"It gives a huge amount of functionality.

"It will change the way stadiums are seen in future."

Worldwide, stadiums attract the same kind of controversy that has dogged the Dunedin example, with public funding of facilities worth hundreds of millions of dollars often unpopular with the ratepayers or taxpayers, who end up footing the bill.

Also overseas, it is not uncommon for stadiums to be sold as "multi-use", or "multipurpose" as those public funds are sought, something pushed strongly in Dunedin during the planning process.

Asked why it was any better than any other indoor venue in Dunedin, Mr Breslin highlighted the economic aspect, something he said was "an essential part of the design process".

"The commercial viability of the stadium has always been of utmost importance.

"Simply put, the stadium has to generate as much revenue as possible.

"This is a standard requirement these days for all stadia and certainly not unique to Dunedin."

Explaining the thinking behind the design, Mr Breslin said there were two sides to the stadium issue, "the sporting side of things", or what happened on the grass pitch, and the space for functions, or whatever else the building was used for.

The client, the Carisbrook Stadium Trust, had been "very clear from the start it was not a sporting building, not [just] a rugby venue".

It needed to be able to cater for functions, conferences and other activities.

"We did a huge number of overlays looking at other uses - operating as a sporting venue is just one of those uses."

Mantra?

You know a mantra is something you repeat over and over again while meditating to try and supress thoughts of the outside world.

Which does rather explain a lot - as the Duke reminds us below it was a movie title, and not a particularly good one at that.

Stadium hype

Such (over) hype. If that's not some sort of 'sideshow'... You'd think we'd built and designed a new 200 seat, fuel efficient supersonic airliner or such, right here in Dunedin, but it's rather something at the other end of the wow factor spectrum, another stadium to replace one that's adequate for its purpose, cost to be forcibly borne by all.

Diversity?

The overall airs given by the railroaders and indeed cult supporter minority of this farce is invariably the same; “you can believe in any project you like that Dunedin should have or needs, as long as it's the stadium.” Diversity is thus a lost word. As the usual two or three stadium pushers have again ably demonstrated. No one likes religion being rammed down our throat, and to some rugby foamers, this is their religion, and indeed we have it forced upon us. So, it has a world first. Oh wow, as fascinating and wow factor as the fact we have the world's largest chocolate waterfall here in Dunedin (at Cadburys). Not really of any huge significance or benefit. It'll certainly be the largest white elephant about, anyway.

What the reasons really are

You have all got it wrong about stadiums and the reasons behind them. It has all become quite clear just today in the ODT. Mr Jim Harland has just been to Kobe as a selected speaker to a WHO (world health organisation) conference on the strategies employed to improve urban health. He says, that while local bodies in New Zealand did not deliver health services as such, it had to take into account the health and wellbeing of residents. Obvious examples were water, sewerage and rubbish services, but less obvious examples included the correct use of lighting, which reduced the risk of violent street attacks, and providing facilities such as sports stadiums and libraries, which improved mental health. So, there we are, the stadium is to benefit our mental health, and if the lighting is good as well, we won’t be violently attacked in it. Excellent, now I will be able to throw away all those anti-depressant tablets and go dancing off to the stadium. Thank you so much Jim, I now see why it is such a small price to pay for such a wonderful benefit. What! Did I just say that? Now where did I put those anti- depressants?

Fantasy revisited

Someone has been watching the "Field of Dreams" again. Just in case you need reminding, this was a fantasy film.

Too right

Right on. "Build it and they will come" is the mantra.

quite right

On their facebook website they invite people who challenge them on this, to call in and discuss the issue with staff. Let's get it out there in public, once and for all. Surely a more efficient way to aid transparency, isn't it?

welcome back

I agree, Roller. Their comments are a vivid testimony to the mouthings of those who cheer for the stadium, but provide no solid justification for it in terms of clear argument. 'Just Build it' pretty well sums up their argument.

The answer then

Not sure what you mean Mike? The CST Trust Website still says: "The seating bowl will be organised into 4 stands. The North, South and East stands will have a permanent seating capacity of 25,000 people and the West stand will have temporary seating for 5,000. However, the Stadium will have the capacity to attain 35,000 people seated and standing should the need arise." Design is now 17,000 odd permanent seats with "2 large concrete slabs" at each end (to quote the Forsyth Barr Face Book Description). One end of temp seating I agree is a good multi-use space, but 2? How often are you going to need 2 ? The documents on the DCC website show that this was a design change, as were the reductions in both north and south stand permanent seating capacities. This reduction of permanent seating and removal of the East stand was done to cut capital costs due to the increased land costs. It represents a $30 per seat loss in operational revenue. That's a big hit on the profit for any event which needs those missing 8,000 seats, go on do the maths.

opening

If you can afford the ticket prices? But then again we only getting tenth rated teams playing here for three games.

vision

Bankruptcy in a few years. Pity they will take Dunedin city down with them.

Fevered supporters

It's great to see funkie01 and mikenette back with their enthusiastic rhetoric. It's amazing what child-like faith and having only short-term memory can do.

Ladies and gentlemen of Dunedin

Rising above political sabotage and "sideshow" prejudice, a monument to all that is good and brave in daring men. An unfaltering purpose of image and design. In the greatest tradition of forethought and exploration. Be impressed, be very impressed. Come one, come all! May I present the positively, superlative , irrefutable Stadium of Dunedin. Hip, Hip, Hooray.

Mitsy

Why is he so sad?

Here we go again

You can't tell me the design hasn't changed' fundamentally' when permanent seating has been reduced significantly from the original projection. Now we are getting the multiuse myth trotted out again. The same arguments can be argued it won't happen.

Remember the peer reviews and what they had to say about the multi purpose myths? All conveniently brushed aside by a majority of our councillors. 'Simply put, the stadium has to generate as much revenue as possible.' You could say that again. How it's stated here is interesting. It sounds like a mission statement. Not a certainty already known- as based on a sound business plan.

 

Obvious answer

The answer is available on the stadium website and has been quoted a large number of times.
What secret? Or is this another suspected conspiracy?
What a great article and brilliant to see work on the bridge piles beginning. It's all coming together and the sense of excitement around it is palpable.

Impressive stadium

Cheer up Mike.. See ya at the opening.

You can't have it both ways

Naturally, the two gentlemen involved with this brainstorm are not going undersell their role in its creation, are they?
Quite some time ago, a document was furnished by the Carisbrook Stadium Trust to CEO Harland which spelled out, quite specifically, that the facilities which have been so lauded in today's O.D.T. are no more than the vacant spaces in which such events could be held.

I have always, and still do, maintain that the cost of these endless quite major conversions for the sake of one-off events will weigh heavily against would-be hirers being able to afford them (not to mention the efforts involved to restore the 'spaces' to a state suitable for the needs of the next and subsequent hirers).

Thus, the whole self-serving article should be regarded in the same light as all the other 'flannel' which has emerged from the publicity-machine which drives this disastrous project against the wishes of an overwhelming majority of those who will, ultimately, foot-the-bill, ie ratepayers, the 'forgotten-people' in this whole equation.

As for the 'Crusty Demons'? I understand that this show relies heavily on its pyrotechnics for 'effect'. I cannot see that
being compatible with what are, in effect, 'plastic' walls and ceiling, can you?

The obvious question?

They designed the thing why not ask them the obvious question? Ask them to show you how many seats there are and where they are - they should be able to settle the controversy easily. So far both Mr Farry and Mr Davies have been unwilling to release the plans so that people can check for themselves - having the guys who designed it explain it should have been easy.

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