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'Not ruling out doing more'

Unless it's a distracting flag referendum this is about as much as we ever get from this government. I believe, in their heads, they view "not ruling out doing more" as "taking immediate and effective action". The status quo is "do nothing" because they would rather leave it all to the private sector (whose actions they cannot be blamed for). But they know if they tell us "we're not ruling out doing more" eventually we'll forget about it.

Unnecessary negativity

No need to be so bitter Missy, it's not a white feather and you know it. Richie McCaw could point the fern out to you if you were willing to listen to the man. I don't agree that the general population is apathetic either with a lot of people engaging on both sides of the flag debate.

Flying alfresco

Bravo, I'd be a Weekend Worrier as some have gone down in Coast bush. You do mean those flying frames? Still remember chartering aero club pilots wanting to log flying hours and being permitted to 'ave a go' buzzing perfectly innocent rural hamlets.

Richie

Nobody cares what McCaw thinks about the flag - he's an overpaid rugby player nothing more.

A helpful, democratic view

Sunny365: My survey of citizens views re flag review was totally unbiased by me so it obviously cannot be classed as "unhelpful". It was a simple statement of facts and actually does not differ from citizens voting for or against one political party or another. And to quote something that happened way back in 2010 in support of a position is as daft as quoting National's decision to go to war in Vietnam back in 1965 to support a position in 2015. Of course I could quote Muldoon's habit of changing laws by Order-in-Council in the 1980's but I won't. My own view is that the Union Jack in the corner of our current flag is a large part of our history and I personally have no desire to discard my history on my flag in favour of a sports emblem. Just my view . . .

You can keep your silver fern

I had a small All Blacks flag this morning. After reading this, it was promptly deposited in the fire. Thanks for the 3 seconds of heat.

You can keep your precious silver fern as most don't want to change the flag anyway, as you're soon to find out.

Nice try

I would use it just because they don't want us to. Even though I dont support the flag change, this is very disrespectful. All the support and supporters obviously means nothing to them. What do they think we are going to do. Front a better rugby team than they have using similar branding? Been busy trademarking all our national symbols have they? Next DOC will trademerk the kiwi and someone will own everything. Go the ABs! No, go further. Go further. Just go. Bye bye. Sick of you.

Range anxiety

The Tesla model S has just been driven 728.7km on a single charge but that was at a constant 40km for around 20 hours on the flat. This model has a quoted range of 491 km on a single charge. That's not too bad I think you would agree.

Democracy means real choice

Ah but sunny when you say "the price of democracy" you might mean it, but when JK says it, it rings hollow. After all where was that belief when JK was stating publically "Referendums are a waste of time and money" while ignoring the results of democracy and decrying the cost in every previous one under this govt. The previous ones were all arguably more important but those were ignored incl MMP and coat tailing, MP numbers, smacking, asset sales, etc.

Also remember under Labour National blocked this very same referendum because they wanted it done on their terms. Remember also we had no say in the final 4, it is quite conceivable that a flag design the majority could have been happy with didn't make the cut.

There is no design that pays tribute to the Union Jack, none that contains a kiwi (by which we are universally known) etc, in other words we get to choose a fern design and that's it, yes the Koru is a baby fern. There are plenty of areas wrong with this whole process that make it a waste of money.

Bad system, bad timing all round. That's why it, despite the spin is a waste of money, it is not democracy when the only options are the same and the limited options are pre selected. With elections at least there are real different choices.

Democracy means real choice and a govt that listens when its people speak. This govt fails on both counts. [abridged]

Flags

If Key was so desperate for a flag change and he genuinely wanted people to have a real say, then why not simply give the people the choice by adding the current flag to these 4 alternatives and ask everyone to vote on which of the 5 they want? That way all the cost of a second referendum is saved and people have real choice. But that isn't what John wants of course is it?

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